"Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff"
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There’s honestly so much info. Posts like this one really do help the casual every day type just wanting good stuff. I’m still learning new things about IH and consider myself uncommonly nerdy with this stuff. Probably like most of you guys reading this. To look down on these casuals and call them dumb isn’t right imo. Everyone starts from a point of ignorance. Not knowing and stupidity are very separate things. There’s nothing particularly wrong with wanting answers spoon fed on a FB group. For a lot of those casuals, it’s their first interactions with the brand. To be answered by Giles himself is really special imo and completely unique. An other of the fuctone of reasons I love you guys!
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I do agree to an extent, especially for newbies. No question is dumb when you’re first getting into this stuff. There’s a ton of information and honestly most of us are still learning things ourselves.
The issue I have, like we saw with the purple western thread the other day, is when people ask the question, get the answer directly from the source, and then just keep going and going and going because they don’t like the answer they were given. That’s the part that gets frustrating.
I see it constantly in the denim world and definitely in the boot world too. Some people just do not listen. You literally have the owner of the company, the person who built the brand and helped bring this stuff to a worldwide audience, explaining exactly why something is the way it is, and people still want to argue with him about his own product. That drives me absolutely batty sometimes.
There’s a difference between being curious and just refusing to accept the answer because it doesn’t line up with what you wanted to hear.
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I see a shift in the individuals who come into the denim world slightly different year to year.
When you go back to the beginning of the forum, you had many denim heads that took great time in their research and trying to understand the intricacies between different denims. Many of the people asking questions already had a basic understanding of what they were looking for. They are the ones who started sharing their knowledge and research to create what the forum is today.
The shift I see is that newer people to this community just want answers without doing much legwork.
I’m not saying that the approach is wrong, as you pointed out that we all started somewhere, but it would be nice if people accepted the answers that were being given. Also, there are many questions that are easily answered by using the search feature here on the forum. I use it daily finding half of what I need in mere minutes.
…but at this point I only sound like a curmudgeon yelling at the clouds. I appreciate we have new individuals coming here as it keeps this place interesting and thank them for doing so. Just want to emphasize that we all need to find the middle ground and respect where the other guy is coming from.
“our policy of no discussions regarding politics, religion, asparagus, and other controversial issues.” - Andrew
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@goosehd I think it's just a result of the hyper capitalized society we've created. You want something? Go on to Amazon and buy it and have it show up at your doorstep 48 hours later. Got a question? Ask AI and get an answer immediately without having to do any thinking. Want food but are too lazy to get off the couch? Doordash. We're all so god damn impatient because we're being conditioned that way.
It seems like it's the same old song and dance, and no matter how many times the IHUK team reiterates to customers the age old production issues IH faces, the singing just seems to get louder. I admire Giles and Alex for being able to put up with these customers for so many years. I wouldn't be able to handle that side of retail, at least not for any extended amount of time.
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@goosehd said in "Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff":
When you go back to the beginning of the forum, you had many denim heads that took great time in their research and trying to understand the intricacies between different denims.
And as a result, we had practically zero returns, the guys had done their research, knew what they were doing, knew that Japanese sizing was not the same at US or European etc etc etc.
Bloody good job too, as in those days, I would queue up for ages in shitty local post offices and sent with extremely high shipping rates, and with virtually no tracking.
I look back and think "how the fuck?"
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Very interesting thread.
Do the mills / manufacturers work exclusively for IH / produce only IH products or do you have to get a ‘slot’ in their production run?
I have absolutely no idea about the mechanics of production and how each cog in the machine fits and works and find it really interesting.
(And at the same time making me glad that I don’t have to figure out a solution!!) -
Better to protect the quality than force output and dilute what made it good in the first place.
Really enjoy Iron Heart personally.
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@RobeOfTheMagi said in "Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff":
@Kasi Honestly, there are some really cool donkeys.
Yeah you keeping looking at them ass‘s
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@Cymro said in "Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff":
Very interesting thread.
Do the mills / manufacturers work exclusively for IH / produce only IH products or do you have to get a ‘slot’ in their production run?Nope. We have 4 dedicated Shuttle Looms in the mill that makes 21 and 25oz denim. They have maybe 50 looms. Personally it pains me that after 25 years of working with them getting more looms from them is like getting water from a stone.
The heavy ounce workshop does work for other brands too. They need to spread their risk, and also make stuff that is easy to make and get some relief from the stress that producing the 21 and 25 oz garments puts them under
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@goosehd said in "Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff":
The mills do not work for IH and yes it is by time slot.
Levi’s has some jump in to using them mills to
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This all makes me want to open a stockist shop in Texas but not offer online purchasing. If you want something you come in the store. Make a vacation out of it. Free beer for the trouble.
As a side note; I’ve been genuinely impressed by how kindly the mods here handle the number of “when will it restock” posts. Especially when the answer is the same 99.99% of the time. It exemplifies what @Chibs said and I agree with. As a relative newbie myself, it’s refreshing to be treated kindly entering a world of existing hard core fans.
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For anyone who has been buying the brand for a (relatively short) while this is the real issue
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It’s probably preaching to the choir here, but I appreciate the anti fast fashion of Iron Heart and other made in Japan brands. When I wear a piece of Iron Heart clothing, I value the experience. The limited production makes them more valuable to me, together with the ‘blink and it’s gone forever’ element of the seasonal releases. I can’t and won’t go back to other clothing. I had a son recently and I hope one day he’ll inherit my old jeans, flannels and denim jackets and appreciate them all over again.
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Pretty hard to put that genie back in the bottle, eh?
I spent several years away from the forum while indulging in other (equally expensive) hobbies, and on returning was pretty surprised to see how the IH product range has exploded. To be honest, i also sometimes reminisce about ‘the simple times’ when there was just a handful of IH options, but the comments in the initial post about diversification make sense.
Good on you for responding to the question so calmly, Giles. Not sure I would have the same level of patience.
Weird times in the world.
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Very cool thread, am pretty new to IH, but was contemplating recently (and explaining to a friend) how out-of-this-world genuine it feels to have answers on a forum from people directly working for the brand, even the bosses
(he did not believe me btw :-D)Since its on topic, I'll ask something I had in mind : those mills, in my poor understanding, are not that common for the quality you guys aim for, and they are low on old looms (please correct me)
Has no one ever tried to (re)produce more of those machines ? To open more mills ? Or is it the experienced people that are lacking ?
Please don't feel obliged to answer this, as this might be somewhat intrusive, but I've always wondered.Another thing related to production that popped up into my mind recently (because I tried my 14oz I recently bought "for the summer" but this thing ain't gonna fly for the damn summer, because at 25C it was already too hot :-D) is this:
Have you ever considered doing lighter jeans ? I mean really light, like 11oz ? Maybe it's not possible while maintaining the quality IH wants.
Only asking since I cannot find something for the summer that drape as good as denim but light enough.
I've been reaching for some old Nudies I still have, but honestly, it's supposed to be 12-13oz but it feels like paper against the 14oz from IH
Sorry for all the questions, One thought led to another.....
Thx again for all those infos, its cool
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@Tago-Mago Many thx ! Great infos there around the looms, very nice to read.
I had been buying Nudies before IH, and back then (2021-2022) they still had a lot of "japan" denim.
Recently I went looking out of curiosity, and saw a lot of their dry denim sourced from Turkey, and also Italy (candiami mill ?)
Maybe also related to this scarcity around quality mills/looms.
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@Slash said in "Why Can't Iron Heart Make More Stuff":
Maybe also related to this scarcity around quality mills/looms.
No,in this case it is cost
