Coronavirus (Covid-19) Discussion
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@jonesy4885:
Hong Kong study in English (Link in this article) @neph93
Excellent, thank you. I did look over The Gruniad expecting it would be there but it looks like I missed it.
EDIT: Having read the Guardian's take, I'll stick to the Norwegian version in the future. VG interpreted the findings with a much more positive angle
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Haha. I’ll take whatever Health Canada Recommends. There advice has been that the best vaccine is the one that’s available and that’s what happened to me. Just a different brand In stock each time I went.
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Any thoughts on the Joe Rogan Podcast featuring Dr. Peter McCullough..
He's Vaxxed, had covid but believes up to 80% of all covid deaths could've been prevented if therapeutics were utilized in "sick" people prior to hospitalization. almost 2 years in and there is no official treatment for covid only the vax..
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@Matt @SKT I tend not to try convincing anyone who is sceptical/hostile to the idea of vaccines. As has been said, it is testing, frustrating and 99.9% of the time a wasted effort, at a time when we all need some extra reserves.
I say this with all respect to @daltmeyer and anyone else with opinions about this based on intuition, gut feelings or a non-science based approach (and I do not mean that condescendingly). We all have ideas and prejudices that wither under the cold light of truth.
I have however met some very wholesome people who are quite strongly opposed to, and worried about the vaccines but have themselves chosen to take it, either because they are concerned for their families, or because they see that it can assist the health service. That is very human, and very warming at this time.
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Any thoughts on the Joe Rogan Podcast featuring Dr. Peter McCullough..
Haven't heard it, but personally I'd take anything said there with a pinch of salt.
Yes certainly good advice, but in this particular instance this doctors pedigree is beyond reproach, it's worth a listen regardless of side, or personal choice. I found it compelling and in many ways eye opening and concerning.
For what its worth, I was vaccinated but I stand with Daltmeyer's personal choice. Fuck mandates
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For what its worth, I was vaccinated but I stand with Daltmeyer's personal choice. Fuck mandates
Fair enough, I'll give it an honest listen.
I also agree that no one should be made to take anything much. However I also believe that someone making that choice regarding vaccines against SARS-COV-19, is taking on a responsibility. It is an individuals right to make that choice, but they should have to accept the consequences of it, be that travel bans, losing their job or not being admitted to public events or private property.
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One exact and actual situation we have tonight here in Oslo at the hospital where i am working is:
100% of patients placed in intensive care and on ventilators are not vaccinated.
The others (half) are vaccinated and are placed under observation and usually can go home after 3 or 4 days.
This is not an opinion. This is a fact.Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk
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It's so strange to me that this mentality has taken such hold. My home state of Mississippi, the most conservative state in the union, historically has had the most stringent vaccine mandates in the country for schoolchildren. Now that being antivax has become a politically conservative position (where antivaxers used to be more often than not whole earth hippie types), we can look forward to Mississippi possibly loosening these rules, and then we will see measles, mumps, rubella, and who knows, polio and other illnesses that we should have eradicated present unnecessary challenges. It's just so unnecessary and avoidable. And if you doubt that it has become political, check this out:
The way epidemiology works requires soft mandates for vaccination. By "soft," I mean, for example, sure, you don't HAVE to vaccinate your children, but don't expect them to be able to go to public schools, daycare, or Head Start if you make that choice. We don't exist in isolation. Even Mississippi understood this (and hopefully still understands that outside the weird exemption people place on Coronavirus). And from a legal perspective, there is long-standing Constitutional precedent for these mandates.
That people in the military–the MILITARY--think they get to say "no" to whatever the hell the chain of command tells them to put in their bodies is especially ridiculous. You signed up to give away that autonomy, full stop.
/end rant
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"It is an individuals right to make that choice, but they should have to accept the consequences of it, be that travel bans, losing their job or not being admitted to public events or private property."
I'll take this one step further, but am going to sound like a cold heartless bastard for doing so…
If someone decides they do not want to participate in the vaccination schedules, I feel that they should also negate any further medical care in case of Covid contraction. Not saying that they should be ignored, but they should not take bed space from someone who has followed all protocols or someone who can't because of previous or ongoing medical reasons.
In a triage situation (and I hope to God that we don't reach that point)...very hard decisions will have to be made about who does and does not receive care. The people who have decided not to participate should be removed from that equation.
I know this thought is not going to be popular...but this thread frustrates me so much...
I hope I don't sound too harsh or too much like an ass. (Just venting)
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So there it is. You really think anyone who doesn't submit to experimental gene therapy shouldn't be able to work. You can't shop for food with no money can you? Just sit at home and hope to starve? For my health? Anyone mandating this garbage is a tyrant and needs to be brought up on charges.
For what its worth, I was vaccinated but I stand with Daltmeyer's personal choice. Fuck mandates
Fair enough, I'll give it an honest listen.
I also agree that no one should be made to take anything much. However I also believe that someone making that choice regarding vaccines against SARS-COV-19, is taking on a responsibility. It is an individuals right to make that choice, but they should have to accept the consequences of it, be that travel bans, losing their job or not being admitted to public events or private property.
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@daltmeyer:
So there it is.
I’m not sure what «it» is, and I do not believe we are a part of a gene-engineering experiment.
In my opinion those of us who live in a democracy have freedoms and rights tempered by responsibilty. I fully support your right to choose not to take the vaccine. However, if society is served by mass vaccination and people decline that offer then not being vaccinated puts others at risk. Society should correctly protect those people. If you have a job where you are not putting people at risk, then there is no issue. If, on the other hand, you work in a nursing home for the elderly then consideration for the nursing home’s patients should outweigh the individual’s freedoms.
To be clear, I’m not saying anyone should be punished for not taking it, I simply believe that freedoms and rights should be balanced by ethics. As @mclaincausey said, none of us live alone.
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a) It's not gene therapy insofar as it doesn't modify your genes. It is understandable to be confused or misled because they use genetic material, but they are using snippets of the virus's genetic material to prompt an immune response as if you've been infected, but without the viral payload that creates an actual infection. It is not modifying your genes in any way–it would have to enter cell nucleus to do that and that simply doesn't happen. Anyone saying otherwise is either ignorant or deliberately misleading you.
b) there is established constitutional precedent for vaccine mandates. So under what law, and for what crime, are you proposing people be brought up on charges?
The reason this is an emotional topic is that many of us believe that misinformation and vaccine resistance is killing people needlessly, including people we admire and/or love.
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The reason this is an emotional topic is that many of us believe that misinformation and vaccine resistance is killing people needlessly, including people we admire and/or love.
Beautifully put. Empathy is the greatest thing we have going for us as a species.
