• Home
    • Recent
    • Calendar
    • Register
    • Login
    Iron Heart Forum
    Iron Heart Forum

    Iron Heart Fall/Winter 2025 Collection Preview - Now Live

    Motor Sport

    Sport
    50
    839
    130.4k
    Loading More Posts
    • Oldest to Newest
    • Newest to Oldest
    • Most Votes
    Reply
    • Reply as topic
    Log in to reply
    This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
    • mclaincauseyM
      mclaincausey
      見習いボス
      Joined:

      And still there is ambiguity in the regulations, so like I said, "some iterations" I think will be required. One season isn't enough for a cost cap regulation to come out perfect in such a complex sport with so many clever people trying to figure out ways to game the regulations.

      Zak has the same idea I do of applying penalties to the following year's cap, but he added something that addresses a problem I hadn't resolved yet with that idea: that a team could just keep violating year over year without caring about penalties if they have the budget for that.

      His idea was two or more minor breaches constitute a major breach. If those two can occur in consecutive seasons, that closes the gap in cap penalties.

      Then again, if your cap gets drawn down year after year, eventually there will be a major breach I guess. I like his idea a lot though to impose a more immediate, meaningful penalty.

      Think it, be it.

      last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • goosehdG
        goosehd
        Mod Squad
        Joined:

        Cheating in sport happens in all venues and all levels.  The seven times Lance Armstrong won the Tour de France were probably the most talked about and most watched of that series's entire history.  Ask the average person who Lance Armstrong was/is and most would be able to tell you and then ask them who the current winner of the Tour is (Jonas Vingegaard - I had to look it up).

        My daughter just finished her cross country running season and told me numerous kids cut corners during practice and the race.  She's 11…  It's hard to tell her that it happens and she should accept it or she should do it herself, because I don't want her too.  I don't agree with it and hope she doesn't and feel my role as a parent is to teach her right from wrong. At the end of the day I hope I'm doing it right, but realize not everyone plays by the same rule book.

        As for F1, is it fair for one team to cheat and gain an unfair advantage...No, but how many others have not been caught (yet).  Drama sells tickets, gains viewers, and viewers buy merchandise.  Like it or not, the entire industry is making money off of this entire situation and the benefits to all of this affects us all.

        Think about the technologies developed for F1 and all of motorsport that trickle down into the vehicles we drive today.  Faster, more efficient, better for the environment, and safer.

        It would be great if there was no cheating in sports, but it has happened since sports began...I don't condone it, just want to state that there isn't a sport today that isn't fixed at some level...

        I do hope they find a way to make it better and more fair for everyone...Just my $.02

        "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

        last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • goosehdG
          goosehd
          Mod Squad
          Joined:

          and to finish my thought process.  How do fix something that most teams are doing (probably) at some level, with teams of lawyers and accountants that look for and exploit legal loopholes?  Is it cheating if it’s a loophole, everyone’s doing it, or a rule that hasn’t been written.

          I used to believe that the legal and justice systems were fair and based upon what is right and wrong…as I got older I realized it’s about how much money a person is willing to spend in order to prove that they’re right.  It’s not fair, but…

          "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

          last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • goosehdG
            goosehd
            Mod Squad
            Joined:

            You could penalize them by making them share the data/technology with all of the teams that was acquired by overspending…

            "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

            last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • mclaincauseyM
              mclaincausey
              見習いボス
              Joined:

              It's definitely interesting to see how cheating intersects this sport. It's one reason I presume that there are spec series out there, to make it all about the driver and pit strategy instead of the complex, multifactorial gumbo that is F1. I think that including car development is a big part of what makes F1 great, but it's also a major source of inequity between the performance ceilings of the haves and haves not, and very difficult to regulate with or without caps in place, and especially with.

              The teams have to agree to the rules, and I don't think you'll get teams to buy into sharing IP as a penalty. That supposedly is how Ferrari wound up in a secret settlement with F1 when they cheated in 2019.

              One interesting idea though for a different "Robin Hood" way of managing the penalties could be that the overspend payments a) apply against next year's cap (as mentioned), b) two consecutive minors constitute a major infraction (also as mentioned), c) the penalty payments incurred by the offending team are shared between the compliant teams to help the smaller guys even the playing ground. Maybe this incremental revenue can be spent without counting against the cap? I haven't thought that through fully, but hurting yourself and helping your opponents in the same breach would presumably get people's attention and hopefully get them to toe the line more carefully.

              Think it, be it.

              last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • goosehdG
                goosehd
                Mod Squad
                Joined:

                Hat’s off to Alonso for that amazing performance today.  Surprised he wasn’t hurt in that accident, but to come back and take 7th is impressive!

                "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

                last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • mclaincauseyM
                  mclaincausey
                  見習いボス
                  Joined:

                  They hit him with a 30s penalty for driving a car in unsafe condition so he fell to P15. Impressive nonetheless as it was scary.

                  Really a great race! I wish Hamilton could heave kept that lead and once again and frustrated with Russell although at least this time he apologized.

                  Meanwhile, I made a thing:

                  Think it, be it.

                  last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • OllyO
                    Olly
                    Joined:

                    Jumping in on this because I usually share my GP thoughts/concerns/elations with @Giles.

                    Full disclosure, I loathe Verstappen - I think he’s utterly gifted, but I’ve hated his lack of grace for a number of years now. I looked back to some of his earlier races, one may have been USA, the other definitely was, where he was taken off the podium twice. Do you guys remember? He overtook Kimi off the track, then out braked himself whilst defending against Vettel but didn’t give the place back?

                    I truly hope that he loses the 2021 championship because of this cost cap issue. He is a more than deserving driver - this year, for example - but rules is rules, no?

                    Lovely to have a rant, and looking forward to any further, compelling points from other F1 fans.

                    Hope you’re all well and looking forward to Mexico this weekend.

                    Olly

                    Stop thinking and start fucking doing..

                    last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • scooterS
                      scooter
                      啓蒙家
                      Joined:

                      "How bad do you want it ?"

                      I have a feeling it won't happen again, though…

                      Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind.

                      last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • GilesG
                        Giles
                        IHUK Crew
                        Joined:

                        Dude's got some balls…....

                        "OK face up to it - you're useless but generally pretty honest and straightforward . . . it's a rare combination of qualities that I have come to admire in you" - Geo 2011

                        last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • mclaincauseyM
                          mclaincausey
                          見習いボス
                          Joined:

                          I agree that Max has been an asshole and an overly aggressive driver, but overturning last season's WDC wouldn't have been appropriate IMO.

                          The injustice was in the stewardship of the race, and while I wish it hadn't happened, I don't think that the infraction justified overturning the result, and I also don't think that something like could come across as anything but a retroactive correction of the race stewardship, which would be a bad look.

                          Think it, be it.

                          last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • GilesG
                            Giles
                            IHUK Crew
                            Joined:

                            Just about everything they have been doing for the last 24 months is a bad look in my opinion…....

                            "OK face up to it - you're useless but generally pretty honest and straightforward . . . it's a rare combination of qualities that I have come to admire in you" - Geo 2011

                            last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • mclaincauseyM
                              mclaincausey
                              見習いボス
                              Joined:

                              I'd go back at least 33 months, but agreed 100%. Such a great league but FIA is a dumpster fire.

                              Think it, be it.

                              last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • GilesG
                                Giles
                                IHUK Crew
                                Joined:

                                Not going to argue, just couldn't be bothered to do the math  🙂 🙂 🙂

                                "OK face up to it - you're useless but generally pretty honest and straightforward . . . it's a rare combination of qualities that I have come to admire in you" - Geo 2011

                                last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • mclaincauseyM
                                  mclaincausey
                                  見習いボス
                                  Joined:

                                  Oh Ferrari…  😃 just comical

                                  Kudos to Haas and Kmag

                                  Think it, be it.

                                  last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • SeulS
                                    Seul
                                    Joined:

                                    R U S S E L L ! R U S S E L L ! R U S S E L L !

                                    last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • GilesG
                                      Giles
                                      IHUK Crew
                                      Joined:

                                      Pretty mature stuff from Max…..NOT....

                                      "OK face up to it - you're useless but generally pretty honest and straightforward . . . it's a rare combination of qualities that I have come to admire in you" - Geo 2011

                                      last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • goosehdG
                                        goosehd
                                        Mod Squad
                                        Joined:

                                        Max is being a “wanger”  😃 Thanks for the new term @Matt

                                        "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

                                        last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • goosehdG
                                          goosehd
                                          Mod Squad
                                          Joined:

                                          Sorry @EdH came up with the term…so I guess @Matt can just… 😉

                                          "I don't give a shit what anyone else is doing, we will do what is best for us and our customers" - Giles P. :)

                                          last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • mclaincauseyM
                                            mclaincausey
                                            見習いボス
                                            Joined:

                                            Total dirtbag move. And not unexpected either.

                                            Think it, be it.

                                            last edited by 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                            • First post
                                              Last post
                                            Copyright Iron Heart 2025.