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Hey again guys. I wanted to ask you a few questions about a couple RRL vintage five pocket East West selvage jeans I purchased. My issue is trying to figure out the fit. But first, I want to thank you guys for being so helpful and open. You are the opposite of that terrible rawdenim subreddit. Now onto the pants.
Normally I am approximately a 31 waist. I purchased two pairs of the RRLs.
The first are a size 32 but according to RL website they are actually 34.75 waist. The second is a size 31 (33.75 waist).
Prior to this I ordered a pair of Red Tornado 55501 in size 31 (last pair), which seem to fit the waist when standing but when it sat, it dug into my stomach in an uncomfortable manner (see pics). I didn’t size up, rather returned them, and just purchased some RRL jeans as the cut was similar and I like the details of the RRL more but I specifically wanted to avoid the waist issue of the red tornado
You can see the 31 and 32 tag size has a bit of room when I stand upright, and when I sit they both hug my belly. Not hurting.
My question is what size should I go with and should I size down to a 30 or 29? I know waist apparently stretches for raw denim but I want these to be comfortable as i sit for extended periods of time and want to keep them for many years. I would like to ability to tuck in a top as well. When I untuck both you can see there is quite a bit of room.
Another factor to consider: I am currently doing more leg workouts and increasing my protein intake. Not sure I’ll necessarily get a larger waist but likely larger legs with time (I am trying to control the gut, but that’s an eternal struggle).
Should I size down to a 30 or 29? Some retailers recommend going down 2 sizes with these jeans. My worry is the same digging into the belly issue though. But a lot of raw denim people say to buy snug and let the waist stretch. But the main reason I am hesitant to do this is I brought some left field greasers and in the store, they fit well in the waist but snug and the store associate assured me they would stretch out, shrink with the first wash, but then stretch out again to original size. Well, after the first cold wash and hang dry, they are quite tight and I don’t enjoy wearing them anymore. I’ve worn them a good amount of times and they have not really stretched out. Waist is fine but everywhere else shrank especially the crotch/seat area and now they look like stupid skinny jeans.
So the last thing I want is to waste twice the money on a pair of RRL and not be able to wear them later.
If you guys can offer any advice that would be great. Again, sitting is fine but standing especially untucked the 32 and 31 are quite loose .
I apologize in advance for my hairy belly and the exposure. I appreciate any advice you guys have.
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@sirkrimzon I’ve moved your question to the RRL thread.
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This post is deleted!
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@sirkrimzon Didn't you post this in Styleforum, too? RRL tends to be vanity sized. If they're digging in your stomach from the get-go, I would size up because yes, they do shrink upon wash and generally will fit snug. I am on wear 90 of their 5 pockets, and they're stayed pretty much the same from wear 1 - no washed tho. And wear a belt!
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@indigostiff what do you think about the new camo jackets hat just came out? Im such a sucker for camo. But it just looks out of place where i live....
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@cyclops I think they're too loud / unwashed. Camo, to me, is great worn as an accent, but man is it loud. It's great for pants, or a washed out top.
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@indigostiff haha yeah i know what you mean. Its loud but i love it...i worry its something i would buy and not be able to wear out haha. Whereas your one its a good balance. They are coming out with so many bangers too
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@indigostiff is there a particular site or place you get RRL stuff from? I found Cultizm to be the cheapest....
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@cyclops I usually troll The Real Real, and run cultizm, etc. when there's sales - which are far and few between lately...
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I like the RRL aesthetic, but I don't think I can see the value. The prices are at IH/RMC/Freewheelers et al level or higher, but the manufacturing is mostly offshored.
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@NickD I like their style and patina out of the box - that's just me. They make unique stuff that oftentimes doesn't require years of wear to look comfortable. That's all.
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@NickD for sure there is a value question. And there is some chunky profit for them.
Easy to pick stuff up on eBay or similar and some incredible deals to be had.
Whilst primarily made in the developing world, the quality has never disappointed me. It’s not stitch perfect like Freewheelers, and they aren’t as tough as Iron Heart, but I’d argue still very high quality.
I love the style for the same reasons I love Freewheelers more than The Real McCoys. It’s got a bit of sense of humour and drama to it. Plus, their use of high end materials delivers the heritage aesthetic, but with luxury feel.
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Latest RRL pulls and creations…
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Was obsessing about their light deck jacket recently. I had tried on Ironheart's version in black last year and regretted not buying it ever since.
Seeing it worn in Silo and Lanterns pushed me over the edge to order RRL's version in khaki. I also picked up their "Worn in black denim trucker jacket".
Both are on their way back to Ralph Lauren unfortunately. The Deck jacket was nice but the arms draped so weirdly. Maybe because of the shoulder seams going past my shoulders. This was just how the jacket was designed and when I looked at the senator in Silo and Hal Jordan, they look just as floppy on them. In fact a bit more so.
It was also cropped shorter than Iron heart's iteration. It's Jungle cloth was not as thick and robust. The zipper was finicky and smaller than I think it should be. Wasn't all bad though, honestly. The jungle cloth was really soft and worn in. They definitely put it through an aggressive washing / wearing process of some kind. The sleeves had a lot of room to get in and out of. From memory, sleeves on Ironheart's lightweight N1 were quite tight for my hands and I remember having to pull hard to get the jacket off. I also like that it had a throat latch. I just think those things are cool. No D Pockets though and I liked that the pocket's were lower and in a more comfortable position on the IH.
The Jean jacket was just not for me. The collar was to large and it was too short for my liking. I know it's a repro from the old Lee jacket and that's how they made them back then. The Denim was also put through an aggressive pre wash and wear process but wasn't particularly soft or thick. The buttons didn't feel nice either. I'm spoiled by my IH type 3's completely.
For what RRL charges I had high hopes. The Deck jacket is quite a bit more expensive than IH's lightweight version and much closer to their full on deck jackets with wool lining. But here's the kicker: Both jackets are made in low cost labour countries. The RRL Deck Jacket is made in India and their jean jacket in Vietnam. So while I'm paying more, the details, cut, and quality isn't on par with Ironheart's offerings. Silver lining is I got a prepaid shipping label for both jackets and I get all my $ back. Eventually. RRL's phone support is in the USA and they were really great to deal with and I appreciate that!
I hope IH comes out with an other khaki lightweight eventually. Something to consider @Alex is wider cuffs and maybe adding a throat latch. I do love those D pockets!! Perhaps I'll end up getting get your regular N1 in Khaki this season if measurements work out. (I have a green in oiled already
)Anyhow rant over. I really do appreciate you guys,(IH) the quality of your stuff and value proposition. It's totally spoiled me though!
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@Chibs The RRL patinas are hard to beat though, out of the box. While I love the process, years go slowly.
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RRL does really nice stuff. I used to have a ridiculous amount of it, but over the years I’ve cut it down to some key jackets, sweaters, shirts and a couple pairs of denim. I still have some pieces I’d consider forever pieces, from relatively inexpensive stuff to some of their more expensive items.
I had that navy jacket when it first came out and loved it, but once I put the IH lightweight N1 on, it was hard to look at it the same way.
I’m definitely not one of those heritage guys who hates on RRL. I still think they do some of the best-looking off-the-rack clothing out there. It’s just hard for me to stomach it when something from IH is basically the same price and feels like it’s built to a completely different standard in terms of materials and construction.
@selveldgesteps
