Arm length - Ultra Heavy Flannels (UHFs)
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Some good reflections and arguments. Here's my tuppence.
I'm one of the shorter heavier guys @Max Power mentioned, so my body shape suits the shorter sleeve length. Generally speaking with IH tops the arms are too long for me. I like cuffing type III's so no problem there and I don't mind rolling up sleeves on some other shirts. But by and large it's an issue. When last winters UHF's were delivered I was delighted. They were the first shirts I'd ever had from IH that fit well everywhere. So obviously I'm disappointed by the change. But that isn't the point here. If the sleeve length is shortened then one group/body type is disappointed, and so on and so on and so it goes. One group is going to be unhappy.
That being said, it seems to me that adding an inch to the sleeve lengths is quite a big deal. If this were the waists on jeans we were talking about then it's the difference between going up or down a whole size. This is why the "you shrink your jeans so shrink your shirts" argument is facetious. Those of us that want to, can buy unsanforized jeans and do this. But you can wear many (all?) of IH jean cuts without having to worry about that. Also, many of us hem our jeans, a service that IHUK, R&H, SE and most serious denim retailers offer free with a purchase, or for a few dollars. None of them offer sleeve shortening as far as I know. There are cuffs to worry about and probably pleats, plackets and gussets too (I'm exaggerating for effect here). So adding an inch to the inseam isn't the same as adding an inch to a sleeve. Add an inch to the waist on jeans; different size. An an inch to a shirt's chest or shoulders; different cut. Am I seriously expected to try hot washing shirts for shorter sleeves and risk a tight chest or shoulders. Unless you have lots of the same shirt to experiment with and a degree of experience then hot washing can be a crapshoot, even with the information on this forum to help minimise the risk. No, ladies and gentlemen, this is not the answer.
As this is ultimately about retail (and customer service) it seems to me that the challenge is to keep as many people as possible happy, as much of the time as possible. Something that @Giles is acutely aware of, as this thread proves. This is to his and IHUK's great credit. That being the case a compromise length seems a good solution, (in lieu of hard statistical evidence that is relevant to your customer base). Maybe splitting the difference here will be the same as splitting hairs, but maybe it would also be a pragmatic solution that would make the most people happy?
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I have a longer torso and arms, the sleeves of my 109 are just about OK, but a tad longer wouldn't hurt.
Reading the sizing chart for the 109 and the 131-BB shirts. I am XL for both and there is a whole inch extra in measured arm length according to the charts for the 131-BB. That would be better for me.
I voted leave them longer…
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I have long and skinny arms. The sleeves on my XXL 101TG are near perfect (after a hot soak/hang dry). I wouldn't mind maybe .5" longer, but the 131 is 1.6 inches longer in XXL, which IMO is overkill.
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For me the latest UHF's (127) are pretty much bang on for me. The 107 in XL has 26.4" arms after a few washes it has come down a bit so that is a long as i would want the arms to be. Any longer and it would be a no no for me.
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I think people tend to forget that IH is a brand that was dreamed up with riders in mind, that denim hipsters happened to fall in love with…..
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^This
Personally, I purchase the shirts/jeans because of the particular emphasis on motorcycle appropriate clothes, and not so much for the fashion appeal.
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Some of the recent UHF's were too short for me; 25" on the Large 101tg stopped me buying it, would have struggled with the sleeve length even without washing it.
That being said, the 131bb sleeves are over 1.5" longer on most sizes than the 101tg, which seems slightly overkill.
It's hard to make much of a call until the seasons shirts have all been released. Like the 101tg was the shortest sleeves in a while, the 131 might be the longest sleeves, and it's just unfortunate that this was the first of the new batch that we all got a look at.
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Just looked at @PattyCakez pictures in the latest UHF and IMO the arms look too long. Now they might be perfect when he riding his bike but who see's that?
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I don't wash the UHFs often so it doesn't seem to be much of a problem-that said I can wear and M or L depending on the look and the shoulders. I will say that if the shoulders on the M stayed around 17-17.5", longer sleeves would make this a perfect cut for me. And because I am the warm center of the universe, you should probably do that. ; )
Un saludo!
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I think people tend to forget that IH is a brand that was dreamed up with riders in mind, that denim hipsters happened to fall in love with…..
I'm not sure anybody has forgotten this. Nor do I think it's particuarly relevant. I think most people are commenting based on what suits them, understandably so.
IH has riding and bikers in it's DNA and that's great. Lots of design choices are made with this in mind, many of them are great for non-bikers too. But lots if IH clothing is not obviously biker friendly and little of it meets technical/safety specs for riding. A lot of it is designed with Japanese biker fashion in mind. I'm pretty sure 14oz white satin finish jeans aren't very practical from a bike riding stand point.
It was Giles that asked for longer sleeves, not Haraki-san, who makes most of the biker orientated design decisions. I love that bikers in the west are discovering IH but the majority of customers outside of Japan are not bikers. Giles is asking this question to get a sense of how the many people on the forum feel about this, so he can make a strategic decision about it that might affect future sales. And good for him.
I'm not worried that IH is going to lose it's biker identity over an inch of sleeve length.
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The only shirt from IH I've ever had an issue with in regards to sleeve length is my 136, which came in at a whopping 28.2 in. in the XXL. I almost exclusively have to wear it with the sleeves cuffed, which is fine on this shirt in particular because it's got a nice selvedge detail under the cuff. But I think that a sleeve that long on a XXL UHF might look a bit silly on my frame.
The UHFs that I do have are the recent ones, and I didn't really have any problem with the sleeve length on any of them. I'm a big guy, about 6'3" and 225 pounds with normal to longish arms and I haven't found myself looking for extra sleeve length personally. But I don't ride a motorcycle or anything like that either.
I guess I would say split the difference or keep them the same as recent releases, but my only hope is that I don't see too many 28 in. sleeves on the upcoming UHFs! -
I have to cuff my sleeves once, regardless of length, so I'm a bit of an outlier. From what I've seen with other brands, a (USA) M or L typically has a sleeve length of 24.5" - 26". I have noticed that the heavier fabrics that IH uses tends to exaggerate the length, since the fabric doesn't stack as readily.
I buy IH shirts knowing the sleeves will always be too long for me, but that doesn't turn me off to future purchases. I buy the shirts because they're beautiful, robust, warm, comfortable and made with great care and attention to detail. Even though it isn't ideal, tailoring is always an option.
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Yeah, I buy my buffalo check UHF´s in XL and shrink them at a 60C wash. 0.5 inches more could be cool, but not a must.
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Please bring back the glory days of the shorter length, compañeros - the new one is really much too long. The shirt is gnarly and pretty cool as every release - unique, beautiful & timeless. But the sleeves destroy all of this. TrickHell said it before: "..there's no way I'm buying a shirt and hoping it fits after I shrink it. Not for $300."
Well said, TrickHell -
Of all the shirts I've bought over the years I only consider one to be a bit on the short side, so I say stay as they were!
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This. -
Exactly. Can anybody of those complaining about too short sleeves post an actual fitpic that illustrates the problem? I've browsed through a lot of pictures and found non with too short sleeves (when the Shirt was sized right and not too small from the start).
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I'm firmly in the sleeves are fine as they were camp, but I roll up my sleeves 90% of the time anyway
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I voted to revert back to the shorter sleeves. This is just my personal preference, nothing else.
However, I must agree with @neph93 with regards to the practicality of IH wear for the motorcyclist. As someone who used to ride motorcycles, there's very little I would have worn from IH with regards to protection. I was very reluctant to even wear a pair of jeans when riding, although I have done, as it provides little protection if one has a spill. Plus there are few IH cuts that would even be practical when riding a motorcycle, ie 634/1955. Most other cuts would be just plain uncomfortable to wear when riding.
As @UnTucked mentions that IH was dreamed up with bikers in mind that denim hipsters, (fuck I hate that word), have fallen in love with. I respectfully disagree. IMO, IH make great clothes for biker hipsters, military-clothing-wearing hipsters, train-driving/house-building hipsters, dudes-on-horseback-roping-cattle hipsters etc etc. This is not a slur on IH, just the way I see it. Hell, I fit into at least two of those categories, & quite happily so. The Lord, & IHHQUK, knows how much I've spent on IH clobber in the past due to its exceptional build quality, & it looks good! Just my $0.02.
