Music
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Roxanne Shante and UTFO, Ll and Kool Moe Dee, Mc Shan and BDP, Nas and Jay Z, i, Biggie and Tupac etc etc t's part of the theatre of hip hop. I bought my first hip hop record in 1983 and have loved it ever since.
He never would, because he's too much of an elder statesman and hip hop ambassador, but I would love to hear Ra the rugged man tear eminem a new arsehole.
There is so much good hip hop, Billy Woods, Elzhi, Odisee, Sa Roc, Apathy, Clear Soul Forces…It the the as always though...shit sells. DMC from RUN DMC did an amazing blog recently asking what the fuck is up with MAINSTREAM hip hop. It needs a 17 year old chuck d or Krs One. I know people rave about Kendrick Lamar but there is better out there. The youth need to hear positivity, not the glorification of material bullshit and fucking mumble rap.
word. I love hip hop from the 80's and the early 90's. Back then it was more about relaying a message, be it a positive message or the overtly political. I also dig the indie stuff that came out in the 00's from labels like Def Jux, Stones Throw, etc. Lots of good stuff from Japan and England too
Don't agree with that. Mid/Late 80's to early 90's was the birth of Gangster Rap which definitely wasn't relaying a positive message to the kids.
I think of PE as being the godfathers of political rap but others like Sir Mix-A-Lot, BDP/KRS-1, etc., had political overtones in some of their songs. Heck, to an extent I even consider gangster rap somewhat political because it shined a light on police brutality and racial profiling. It might not have been positive but it definitely had a message that's still relevent today. But, there was plenty of good hip hop that came out during that era that didn't rely on cliches to sell records.
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PE was definitely political but yeah….don't think that as a whole rap was sending positive messages to the kids and wasn't utilizing certain cliches to an extent.
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PE was definitely political but yeah….don't think that as a whole rap was sending positive messages to the kids and wasn't utilizing certain cliches to an extent.
Who named 'gangster rap'? Was it the disenfranchised you black and Hispanic people that made hip hop with themes about their social experiences? NO it was large record labels like interscope and Atlantic, and the mainstream media press.
I remember it. NWA wasn't called 'gangsta rap' in 1987 when their first record was released (NWA and the Posse - that had Easy E's dopeman on it).
The music then didn't glorify a lifestyle, if shone a light on its pitfalls. It highlighted youth deaths and police brutality, political and social unjustness. For me as a youth it was the first music to really do that since punk 10 years before.
Trouble is, some artists then become susceptible to the market forces. They get ghost writers in because they don't have creative talent themselves (the DOC famously wrote much of NWAs lyrics).
When Ice T, Kool G Rap, NWA, BDP, public enemy were all writing metaphorical lyrics about violence, there were also popular artists such as Divine Styler (on Ice T's label rhyme syndicate), De la soul, tribe called quest, Chubb Rock, all making afrocentric hip hop.
Many cite Schooly D as being the first gangster rapper with songs like PSK (Parkside killers, a gang from his Philly neighbourhood). I have always thought it is easier for a predominantly white owned mass media to put negative connotations on the lived black experience…don't call it gangster, call it socioeconomic experience.
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@Seul thanks for the heads up mate
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Who named 'gangster rap'? Was it the disenfranchised you black and Hispanic people that made hip hop with themes about their social experiences? NO it was large record labels like interscope and Atlantic, and the mainstream media press.
I remember it. NWA wasn't called 'gangsta rap' in 1987 when their first record was released (NWA and the Posse - that had Easy E's dopeman on it).
The music then didn't glorify a lifestyle, if shone a light on its pitfalls. It highlighted youth deaths and police brutality, political and social unjustness. For me as a youth it was the first music to really do that since punk 10 years before.
Trouble is, some artists then become susceptible to the market forces. They get ghost writers in because they don't have creative talent themselves (the DOC famously wrote much of NWAs lyrics).
When Ice T, Kool G Rap, NWA, BDP, public enemy were all writing metaphorical lyrics about violence, there were also popular artists such as Divine Styler (on Ice T's label rhyme syndicate), De la soul, tribe called quest, Chubb Rock, all making afrocentric hip hop.
Many cite Schooly D as being the first gangster rapper with songs like PSK (Parkside killers, a gang from his Philly neighbourhood). I have always thought it is easier for a predominantly white owned mass media to put negative connotations on the lived black experience…don't call it gangster, call it socioeconomic experience.
That's been my take on music genres. I didn't really like the term 'grunge' being bandied about back in the 90's as it felt like a cheap way for labels to capitalize on the success of bands like Nirvana, AiC, Soundgarden, etc. Likewise, I didn't like the term 'gangster rap' being attributed to those groups that rapped about topics that were part of their experiences. I think this is part of the reason why the indie scene took off in the early 00's. A lot of these artists weren't under the thumb of major labels and had more creative freedom to make what they wanted to make.
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^^^Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!
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PE was definitely political but yeah….don't think that as a whole rap was sending positive messages to the kids and wasn't utilizing certain cliches to an extent.
Who named 'gangster rap'? Was it the disenfranchised you black and Hispanic people that made hip hop with themes about their social experiences? NO it was large record labels like interscope and Atlantic, and the mainstream media press.
I remember it. NWA wasn't called 'gangsta rap' in 1987 when their first record was released (NWA and the Posse - that had Easy E's dopeman on it).
The music then didn't glorify a lifestyle, if shone a light on its pitfalls. It highlighted youth deaths and police brutality, political and social unjustness. For me as a youth it was the first music to really do that since punk 10 years before.
Trouble is, some artists then become susceptible to the market forces. They get ghost writers in because they don't have creative talent themselves (the DOC famously wrote much of NWAs lyrics).
When Ice T, Kool G Rap, NWA, BDP, public enemy were all writing metaphorical lyrics about violence, there were also popular artists such as Divine Styler (on Ice T's label rhyme syndicate), De la soul, tribe called quest, Chubb Rock, all making afrocentric hip hop.
Many cite Schooly D as being the first gangster rapper with songs like PSK (Parkside killers, a gang from his Philly neighbourhood). I have always thought it is easier for a predominantly white owned mass media to put negative connotations on the lived black experience…don't call it gangster, call it socioeconomic experience.
Relax dude. It's just a term used so that everyone can immediately identify what music and artists I'm referring to. With all due respect it's a little amusing that you're preaching and trying to drop knowledge about all of this when I'm guessing that at the time it was happening that all you knew about it was what you saw on TV and heard in music. There is definitely a gangster element to it and you'd be blind not to see that…sure they also rap about their socioeconomic experience but certain elements were absolutely glorified.
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Yeah that was out of nowhere. I mean I guess all or most celebrity deaths are but if I had to make a list of celebrities who I predict would OD he wouldn't be in the top 10.
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I'm not afroamerican or Latino, not from Queensbridge projects or Watts. I have carried knives, sold drugs, had guns aimed at me, had friends go to prison. The catalysts to these aren't exclusive to black 80s Compton. Asher D and daddy Freddy, overlord X, Hijack, London posse…toxteth and Tottenham riot's. It's universal, not local.
Music can join or decide. If the industry is left to draw that line then we continue to head in this direction. If the artists regain control, hope!
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@manufc10 I get it. Lots of us have strong opinions here. I love that.
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I'm not afroamerican or Latino, not from Queensbridge projects or Watts. I have carried knives, sold drugs, had guns aimed at me, had friends go to prison. The catalysts to these aren't exclusive to black 80s Compton. Asher D and daddy Freddy, overlord X, Hijack, London posse…toxteth and Tottenham riot's. It's universal, not local.
Music can join or decide. If the industry is left to draw that line then we continue to head in this direction. If the artists regain control, hope!
I'm not sure what the fact that you've sold drugs, carried knives, etc is supposed to prove. I've experienced all of what you've mentioned and then some multiple times over and buried way too many friends who were victim to homicide. I also have many friends and family members who have been incarcerated….but so what.
There were absolutely specifics to what was going on in LA at the time (LAPD tactics to name one), and other US cities as well (Sheriff Joe Arpaios tactics to name one) which ultimately culminated in the LA riots and what was reflected in the music coming out at the time. You are/were 4 thousand plus miles away from any inner city in America with predominantly Hispanic and black populations with rampant gang activity, I was/ am not. I don't know what circumstances are or were where you grew up so I can't speak on them as if I do, and I wont.
Your initial post to me came across as if you were trying to educate me on what experiences were being reflected in American hip hop at the time, which I'm well aware of, yet you're half way across the world from it. If I misinterpreted your tone then thats my bad. I'm sure you've had your experiences and of course there's issues and shit going down in cities all over the world. I dont speak on that like I know or try to educate others on it. I know shit definitley gets lost in translation via text so again, I may have misinterpreted your tone.
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@manufc10 I seem to have turned what started as a music thread into a random rant thread! Oops.
There was always and still is a huge divide in the hip hop community (Yep, global, the Zulu Nation is everywhere!) About the labels gangster rap or reality rap. It might seem like semantics, but the labels have such a huge influence on mainstream societies perception of those groups/demographics. That was my only point, and you are so right, email, text, posting, they can lose so much context in translation.
Music can be so powerful. We all see that. I'd just love artists to take control back from the industry, for there to be more independent labels like mellow music group and rhymesayers with positive artists for kids to hear. More Jean Gray and less Stefflon Don. More Oddisee and less Lil….whoever.
As citizens our only real remaining democratic power left is how we choose to spend our money and how that affects decisions that the economy makes.
Anywho @manufc10 things seemed to work out for us over the years…I mean, we are having this chat across the ocean on a high-end denim brand website! I hope we are both doing ok
